6048e

[StefanNowak]

It might be worth looking on the inter web for big pics of E Series patchbays? that's how I got a little heads up about mine prior to the console arriving..

Stef.

[madmuso]

Regarding loosing an insert return, this is 99% the 5534 in the "Patch Return" circuit, on the Channel Amplifier card.

IC9 on a G series
IC5 on a transformer E series

Pop a new one in :-)

thanks for the reply, so, im assuming this is a part that requires each of the actual channel strips to be raised out of the console and fitted? Doesnt sound like it would be too difficult.  The owner of the console has already taken them out a few times to change other parts so hopefully we can get it sorted.

[madmuso]

Hi, I'm baffled by the lack of a straight L & R mix out from patchbay L/M as well. My SSL drawing shows L21 & 22 unlabelled but they are normalled down to M and then to DL 31 cct 15 & 16. On the same DL, it shows Prog L & R outs (from M7 & M8) go to DL cct (circuits) 21 & 22 . Try taking the patchbay out and look at the cable idents as this will give a clue. Also look at L/M 10 and 11 for more clues. I'm sure the answer lies with patch L/M as N/P deals mostly deals with returns to the console.

CR monitors should come out of L37 & 38 and mini's out of L39 & 40. I would imagine that, if you plug the CR mons into the SLS outputs as a temporary measure, they would cut out if you were recording as these are a playback function and, logically, would not be activated during a recording as they would spill onto the live room recording mics creating feedback.

To hear a compressor in the final mix before going to PT, you need to hear the results over the monitors of course before the signals leave the SSL as you suggested. Err, so far, I'm running out of suggestions but I would certainly recommend taking the patch out to identify the individual wire idents. Maybe L21 & 22 were rewired by the previous owner. If that is the case, you should easily see the difference in wiring and looming.

Hope this helps a bit more but, bear in mind I don't have an SSL anymore and my thoughts are based on memory and the odd bit of written documentation I have available. If I had your console here, I could very easily sort out these problems.

Tried the suggested CR monitor patch numbers, no luck, I tried the ones suggested as well as a heap of other ports on the patch and nothing, seems the only monitor outs working are the ones designated for the Studio. i will tackle this again soon, I have another question that I have been confused on for a bit, bear in mind im back at home and not in front of the console when writing here so I may get a few things mixed up, sorry.

as you guys are aware, each channel has 5 separate cue send knobs ( a stereo one, top of the row) followed by 4 mono ones, the mono ones are labelled 1-4 and the top knob is just labelled "stereo". Am I correct in thinking that during tracking these "cue sends" are used to send separate mixes to the artists, and during mixdown are the actual "sends" to fx units? The reason im asking is because from memory in the master section there seems to be a master "cue return area" as well as a master "echo return" area but no actual "echo sends" anywhere that I can see, so, im assuming that during mixdown the fx units should be patched into the echo returns as the master echo returns section caters and is designed to treat the fx during mixdown? Just another piece of the SSl puzzle im trying to put together, fun times!

As soon as I make sense of this then i can try to figure out where the 8 channel headphone amp gets its signal from, each channel on the headphone amp has a L and R stereo input so I have a bit of figuring out to do. yay.

[madmuso]

hey guys,

I got my hands on the manual and have been reading and taking notes like a madman. Im not sure if its my interpretation or conflicting details from different parts of the manual thats confusing me regarding the sends and returns, cues, etc. So here is exactly what the manual says:

SECTION 3-12 (channel strip details section)
Cue and Aux sends.

During the recording process the stereo and the first two mono buses may be used as headphone feeds. All the Aux send buses are found on the jackfield (N1-6) and can be used as feeds to effects units. The stereo and the first two mono sends are simultaneously routed back into the centre section (jacks P5-8) where talkback and additional external stereo feeds, via the CUES pot, can be added.

After the addition of talkback, stereo reverb from the stereo reverb returns, and a stereo external source the cues appear on the patch row N9-14. These outputs are then normalled to the feeds to the headphone power amps (jacks P9-14).

Cue 1L and 1R are derived from AUX 1, and CUE 2L and 2R are derived from AUX 2.

Section 5-4 (master section details)
Cue-Aux sends:

Each channel is fitted with one stereo and four mono auxiliary sends for use as foldback, echo sends or as mix minus feeds.

Auxiliary sends 1 to 4 appear on the patch N1-4 where they are normalled to the outgoing jacks P1-4 to be used as feeds to effects units.

Aux 1 and 2 together with the stereo sends are simultaneously fed back into the communication section of the master facilities module where talkback (via buttons in the communications section), stereo reverb (via the echo returns) and external stereo feeds (via the external to studio selector) can be added.

Three stereo Cue outputs then emerge on the patch N9-14 for use as headphone foldback. Note that Cue stereo is derived from the stereo send on each channel, cue 1L and 1R are derived from aux 1 and Cue 2L and 2R are derived from aux 2.

Section 8-2 (the patch section)
echo sends (N1-4):

These carry the Aux 1 to 4 outptus which are normalled down to the effects send lines (P1-4) out of the console. Jacks P1 and P2 are also wired to jacks N7 and N8 which, together with the stereo send outputs on N5 and N6 are normalled back into the console (via jacks P5-8) for the addition of talkback, stereo echo and stereo external sources. These Cue outputs then emerge on jacks N9-14 as three stereo cue sends.


So, am I correct in saying that you can only have 3 separate headphone mixes going on at any one time during tracking? And why have they stipulated 2 different rows for headphone outs?

Ive attached a copy of the patchbay layout so it helps when reading the above.

Im gonna head over there tonight to try to make more progress.

http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q142/madmuso/patchrowsKLMNPRS.jpg

[madmuso]

heres the entire patchbay layout in case somebody wants it, im sure you guys already have it but I thought i'd scan it while I was at it.

thanks,

http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q142/madmuso/6000sreiespatchbay.jpg

[sintech]

Regarding loosing an insert return, this is 99% the 5534 in the "Patch Return" circuit, on the Channel Amplifier card.

IC9 on a G series
IC5 on a transformer E series

Pop a new one in :-)

thanks for the reply, so, im assuming this is a part that requires each of the actual channel strips to be raised out of the console and fitted? Doesnt sound like it would be too difficult.  The owner of the console has already taken them out a few times to change other parts so hopefully we can get it sorted.

Exactly that, you can scope the channel through, but when you've had that fault 10 times before, and the fix is always the same.. hehhehe. If you run as faults book, it will help you with future problems.

[madmuso]

Hey guys,

we finally made some progress! 

Inserts are all done and working.

We now have our nearfield monitors plugged into the correct ports on the patch (L37 and 38). And the monitor "source" buttons in the master section along with all the other monitor related routing (in the master section) is all working! The currrent owner seemed to be under the impression that the previous tech had disconnected parts of it for some reason, doesnt seem to be the case though.

As far as the main mix (programme) output goes, we are still using ports L21 and 22 which has "mix" written on them by the previous owner, and we are currently using M21 and 22 as the main mix insert (again, it has "insert" written on those ports by the previous owner). After inserting some outboard across the main mix I then patched it back into multitracks sends 1 and 2 and the signal appears on the AD converters! just what we wanted, however for some reason the RME hammerfall wasnt seeing it, but thats another issue I'll sort out upon next visit.

I am now going to move onto the send and return section of the console and try to nut it out. I am slowly starting to understand the console, with each session the picture is starting to become clearer, still a while to go though, but man, what a great design!

We are currently patching in every input and output from the outboard pre's to user patchbays, while we were discussing this yesterday a question arised regarding bass guitar recordings. You would normally plug the bass guitar into the high impedance input on the preamp usually found on the front (if the bass player was in the control room), but what if he is in the studio and you just want to record DI, does this mean you have to plug the bass into a DI box (converting it to mic signal), then from the DI into the stage box, then patch it in from the consoles "mic lines" patch bay into desired preamps mic input?

Thanks for all the help guys, between here and the manual im sloooooooooooooooowly getting it, thanks heaps!

[Matt Sartori]

not to be too picky but can we use the term socket (patch bay socket that is) instead of port?
just to call things with their right name 

Mattia.

[madmuso]

sure thing, socket it is!

Guys, can someone tell me what the far right hand side of the console is called/referred to? Im talking about the section that has the two XLR sockets and some talkback features, the copy of the manual I have here doesnt mention this part of the console at all, perhaps the copy of the manual is incomplete, i dont know. I want to be able to read about this section to know how it works, etc. Also, a few of the buttons have been replaced by the previous owner but dont have anything written on them, they are just blank buttons so we are lost right now.

I want to find a picture and details on the net but I dont even know where to start because I dont know the correct name of this section.

thanks

Thanks,

[sintech]

I think it's known as a 621 Producer Panel. Jim would know the variants, in my experience, it's an outmoded feature, and some musician always places a magazine on (or similar) latching the talkback open.

[jimlfixit]

Hi, as Sintech stated, this is probably an outdated feature these days. The Producers Panel section is all the 19" stuff (if fitted) at the other end of the console to the patch. This could be for mounting client equipment or SSL supplied items like a stopwatch, 693? printer (I'm not kidding) or even the 621 3u Producers Panel. This was meant to be for a Producer to listen to or talk back to various places.

The 621 Producers Panel has a built in mic on the left and switches to talk back to the MD (Musical Director), TB Cues (TalkBack Cues …so the musicians can hear what the Producer is saying) and Omni, which talks to everywhere and can be dangerous (hence in red) as the Producer could end up swearing on tape!!! I can't remember exactly what the Dim switch does but I think it reduces the talkback level from the 621 panel by several decibels.

The listen mic switch allows the Producer to hear what the musicians are saying in the studio via the listen mics in there (which appear on the patchbay) and there are two sets of controls to allow the Producer and others to listen to cue stereo, auxes 1 and 2 and the monitor mix via the headphone jack socket which is linked to the 3 way XLR. I think the jack tip was wired to pin 3 on the XLR judging from a picture I have.

The blank buttons above are user options and are not wired. Later versions of the 621 panel could be remotely wired elsewhere in a Control Room via DL 59, hence the gap in DL numbering if you haven't got this facility. The 24 way Bicc plugs into the console loom or DL 59 if fitted.

One amusing story on this. About 1981, the SSL buyer bought the wrong type of jack socket and quite a few panels were made with type B jacks (GPO versions). Only in final test did this get revealed as the headphones didn't work as 1/4" type A jacks are different to type B meaning some contacts shorted or were open circuit when plugging in a standard type A jack on a headphone lead to the type B fitted on the panel. Type A versions are commonly used in the recording industry of course and type B are really mostly used for older broadcast type patchbays so, beware in future!

Hope this helps from Jim Lassen.






 

[madmuso]

wow, once again, cool routing! Thanks for the pics too Jim.

So, is this the SAME talkback mic thats activated when you press the "cue stereo", "cue 1" or "cue 2" in the communication section, or is there another inbuilt talkback mic somewhere on the console?

While on the subject of talkback, in the communication section, is it possible to engage the "cue" and "listen mic" buttons together so you can have a discussion with the artist in the studio or do you have to toggle from one button to the other during conversation?

As usual, thanks for the help! Another piece of the puzzle is complete!

 

[madmuso]

hey guys,

we have been busy patching in all the outboard at my friends place, what a task, taking forever but so worth it having all the outboards in and outs on the patchbays.
We have made a lot of progress as far as understanding and operating the console goes so its all coming together, the more I learn and play with this console the more I love it! Problem is, now I cant see myself using anything else ever! Time to start saving.

I have a question regarding the reverbs units which we are hooking up to the empty user patchbays. Some units have one input only and 2 (L and R) outputs, which I understand, you would send for example a mono snare drum channel to it and have the reverb come back stereo to 2 faders on the console.
Some of the reverb units have a left AND right input, when would you use the right input? IS it for example, if you had a left overhead on one channel (panned left) and a right overhead on another (panned right), you would send the left channel to the reverb units left input and the right overhead to the units right input (and the reverb units returns would be panned accordingly). I would love to hear peoples suggestions from experience as to which is the best way to hook these units up.

Also, we have discovered that one of the cue channels has some serious hum happening, its plasma is always showing the hum present. You cant hear it through the control room monitors ( the consoles monitor and channel paths seem to be ok) but once we plugged the headphone amp in to experiment with cues it was really there and very annoying. Any thoughts?

thanks, hope everyone is doing well!

[madmuso]

Hey guys,

does anyone have or has anyone used this device? Looks like it could make life easier when integrating the console with Nuendo.
Its called Konnektor.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s5M-RzOTcW0

By the way, we are almost done patching the outboard to the consoles patchbay, what a task. Im starting to do research on the best way to sync the 6000e to Nuendo and Apogee clock and converters.

thanks,

[StefanNowak]

Hi mate,

I'm using The Konnektor here, it works perfectly and I highly recommend it.

Stef.