SSlmixed.com Forum
Tech discussion => 4K,6K,8K Series => Topic started by: christiancarvin on February 27, 2014, 06:03:34 PM
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Hello Every one!
What lube would you advice me in order to preserve my switches from stucking?
Thanks!
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You're talking about the routing-cards right?
I know my comment will start a debate, and that will be good. So here I go...
I'm currently cleaning my routing cards by putting them in a glass of Isopropyl-Alcohol. After a short time, you see a lot of dust and hair come swimming in the glas. I clean the fluid with a coffee-filter and do it another time. After the 3rd time my routing cards are clean and sound and feel like new.
My take on this is that any lube applied will only serve as a dust-magnet. I'll just leave it like that and we'll see what happens.
My G-Series Console has about 50% original routing cards from 1992, and the other 50% replaced 6 years ago. The newer ones are totally fine (I still give them a clean though), the 1992 sound and feel like new after the cleaning. Time will tell how long they will last.
I did not have any problems with the switches to be stuck, unless I open them. Thats why I don't open them. There is enough space for the Alcohol to flush out the dirt.
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Dust and hair- maaaaaaake iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiit stooooooooooooooop. Don't forget about the skin and other stuff.
I agree if you are doing the washing up. Don't coat your plates and utensils with grease after you are finished. Metal contacts are different. Especially if they are plated. Think about it, if lube did not make a positive contribution, then switches would be supplied dry. There was an old-school promoted practice of using an abrasive pen eraser to clean edge contacts but that became a destructive action once contacts were plated.
Mike
PS: I don't have and have not had any ownership, directly or indirectly in petroleum or non-petroleum lubrication interests producing said products such as lube, conditioning, TWEAK, Zap, etc.
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Michael,
what you've said on this forum always made a lot of sense to me, so I'll give it a try.
Is it Caig ProGold that you would use for that?
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Thanks for your answers :D! The switches are those for ch/dyn/mon, bell, pre....
I had to clean them with contact cleaner spray, but I find some of them a bit hard to press now....
That's why I wanted to use lube....
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These are not much different from the switches used on the later routing cards.
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For switches I like LPS1. It is a "greaseless" lube. I use it in a dropper bottle or IM hypo. There are tech hypos available but they tend to leak if not kept upright.
The progold is more for connectors where it can be applied with cloth or swab.
I do not recommend spraying lube into things as it coats the area around even if you surround with paper. Too much pressure.
Mike
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Thanks Michael!! ;)
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It all depends on the switches, if they are black and clear, you can use any contact cleaner and cycling to rinse out the filth then a treatment with deoxit or deoxid, 2 different products and I could be wrong on the spelling, but they both work great.
I have seen black switches with clear covers on 8K's where nothing would save them and they have to be replaced, (some 8k's only). Then there is the blue and white switches (alps) these usually seem very good and the one time I did try to clean one, it gummed up and was useless, so leave the blue and white ones alone until somebody can chime in with more data, Marc, hit your switches with some caig deoxit or progold it can only help! (unless they are the blue and white ones) When I do replace switches I do phase, insert, eq
and dynamics.
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The routing switches on my 91/92 G-Series Console are all the "blue and white" ones. As I said before, they are great after bathing them in Isopropyl-Alcohol. No problems yet.
I've tried to open a few, but could not get them back together after that so I wouldn't really know how to apply any lube.
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Mine are whites (routing switches are fine they have been treated with ultrasound)
But the others on the module (ssl 4000E 1979's desk) make some cut in the sound or thin distortion (mainly the red phase switch)
It's a lot better since I used contact cleaner...But I've read on some topics that contact cleaner can deteriorate switches...That's why?
Should I use LPS1 on them?
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Somebody will at some point slap me for saying the word "Isopropyl-Alcohol" far too often....
I've had the same problem with some of the phase switches. (and other switches, e.g. "SPLIT", Insert "PRE" & "IN").
I take the channel out and put it in my costum stand. Then remove the knob cap, drip above mentioned fluid into the switch and press it about a hundred times like a mad man.
Be careful as the fluid will come out of the switch at the bottom, so catch it with a towel or similar.
Solved my problem 10 out of 10 cases.
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Thanks man!
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The only time I have seen any problem with using any cleaner on any switch was with the blue
and white alps, it some how gummed up the lube that was in there and would make them
stick. You can also put the black eq and dynamic switches in a ultrasonic cleaner for a few
minutes then treat them with deoxit, if you use alcohol or cleaner only, the switches contact
plating can wear off eventually, everybody should do a group order and get some
Schadow or e-switches you can find them here and there but I think e-switch
will do a run that takes about 10-weeks. I bought thousands of nos a few months
ago.
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Dirt and "gunk" are the primary killers of switches working well, if the switch has been subject to high humidity and moisture for long periods of time (think unheated storage) it may have problems with oxidation as well.
Cleaning out the switch is usually by some form of flushing, iso-alcohol may do that well or an ultra-sonic bath with water based solvents (often citric based). After a thorough flushing and solvent based cleaning, you need to get lubricant back into the switch again, or it will wear out much sooner than you want and they you will HAVE to replace it. Lubricants for switches are a very fine oil that clings to the surfaces and does not evaporate easily. Almost all the spray manufacturers make a lubricant, LPS, Caig, EML, etc. They are not the same as the cleaners. Check the labels or web sites of the manufacturers for the correct names.
Some switches may be made of materials that will melt or be damaged by some solvents, always be wary. Test first. Better to replace one switch than a whole lot of them.
There are at least two switch boards for the routing switches, they have different form factor hole for mounting the switches, the older ones used either Dialco or Isostat switches (forget which) which are unobtainium now. The newer ones use the ALPS or similar type switch lead spacing. I thought the new ones used the PH series E-switch spacing, but I won't swear to it. Calipers and the spec sheet are your friends.
schadow switches are readily available (although the numbers in stock appear to be limited at the moment) But I'm not sure the standard schadow switch is the correct size.
Cheers,
Alan
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Thanks Alan for those precisions!
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Hello Marc!
What's your opinion after so many time? Did the time deteriorates the things?
What is the final verdict?
My G-Series Console has about 50% original routing cards from 1992, and the other 50% replaced 6 years ago. The newer ones are totally fine (I still give them a clean though), the 1992 sound and feel like new after the cleaning. Time will tell how long they will last.
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I've used the ultrasonic cleaner with a citrus based cleaner.
Like Alan said - you need to get the lube back in. I know of a console where the switches were cleaned with an aggressive degreaser and not relubed. A year or so later the switches had oxidized to hell and had to be replaced.
Here's what I've always used.
Miller Stephenson - Contact Re-Nu & lube MS-738
It cleans up your funky switches.
An SSL tech turned me onto this stuff in the 80s.
Back then it was called Contact Restore & lube.
It works wonders, and safe on plastics.
Leaves a light lube. I actually use a drop of it to lube the fader rails.
It's expensive and you have to buy directly from Miller Stephenson as in call them.
I buy it by the case, but I think minimum order was like 4 cans.
There are other versions that go under the Contact Re-Nu & lube name.
Make sure it's the MS-738
I believe the MS-738M is just an 8oz can.
The MS-739 states it is not safe for plastics, and I've never tried it.
I've used the EML contact cleaner lube as well. It was recommended by Jeff Tanner for our Neve. It bubbles up and gets into those Neve mic pre gain switch assemblies nicely. I have however never tried it on the SSL. As Alan said some of those cleaners will melt plastic and can mess up the switch latching. I have a can of LPS in the shop, but I personally wouldn't spray that stuff in an SSL switch.
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good comments from Rich.
Miller is good stuff too.
EML is available in one off quantities from Newark Electronics in NA and Fastnal in europe.
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Old Thread, Just wondering, Has anyone ever used EML 200f on the SSL switches?
This was recommended by a Neve Tech. Yet unsure if its good for our switches?
Just ordered 24 channels worth of switches for my console. (EQ DyN) ones. Lots of scratchy and glitchy switches.
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heartily recommend EML200 contact lube, ssl, neve, or whatever.
its spay tube dispensed but wll controlled unlike Caig products
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Wonderful!
Now it’s just a matter of time till it arrives. Almost a week so far. Haha Newark doesn’t know where it is!