Author Topic: Working without Recall computer  (Read 8918 times)

axegreg

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 9
  • Karma: +0/-0
Working without Recall computer
« on: May 17, 2017, 06:35:08 PM »
Hi all,

I'm wondering if some of you are working on the 4000 desks without the Recall computer. What's your workflow for tweaking mixes? I'm interested in insights for on the desk and ITB tweak workflows. Thanks a lot.

Jimbob

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 6
  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Working without Recall computer
« Reply #1 on: May 20, 2017, 04:36:11 PM »
From http://www.aesproaudio.com/ssl-mini-consoles/

The VCA To Meter function is invaluable. Apart from being an integral part of the sound of a 4k this gives you accurate recall of the main fader positions. All I do at the end of each mix is take one photo of each bucket of 8 VU meters (so three photos in all, channels 1-24). I then take one photo of from above (of all the eq, comp, aux & routing settings) of channels 1-16 & then another photo for the centre section & channels 17-24. Obviously I do the same for any outboard & the patchbay too. I then stick all the photos in a folder called recall photos & put that folder in Pro Tools session folder. The whole console can be recalled with 5 hi res photos. When recalling all you do is open the photos on your monitor & zoom in (ironically not unlike the TR computer) & reset. I’ve found this method to be accurate and as fast as the TR on my old G+.

If you’re not going to use the small fader as additional sends then you have 48 channels + the 4 stereo effects returns. What I do with the Small Fader (tape inputs) when I need more returns I set all the small faders I’m using to the 0db mark on the panel. It doesn’t matter if this is 0db or not. The point is it’s the same all the time and therefor repeatable. I then use the Waves SSL plugins with the Analogue button switched out on those channels. Obviously this gives you full recall within the Tools session. Sounds pretty close too.

Re effects. I’ve come up with a way of using reverbs etc from Pro Tools from both the console and from within Pro Tools. I route all my aux send effects outputs to between 1 and 8 Pro Tools outs and patch them to the effects return section of the console. It just sounds better to me that way.

Set your sends from Pro Tools as normal. Obviously the tracks on the small fader will access these effects from within Pro Tools as normal (ie, after eq and comp etc) via the Pro Tools mixer sends.

You then create 24 mono Aux inputs (I also create 12 stereo ones for stereo tracks) in Pro Tools & route all their outputs to a bus you are not going to use. If you don’t assign the Aux tracks to a output then it won’t work post fade and that’s the whole point of this.

Assign the inputs of those Aux track to SSL ins 1-24 (multitrack sends)
When you want to put the same reverb on say the lead vocal that is maybe on the bvs you have on the small fader simply press the Direct out button on the SSL channel that the vocal is returning on, go to the aux track that corresponds to that desk channel & send to your reverb in Pro Tools from that aux track. You now have automated sends with recall that are post fade, eq and comp from the console.

Using the Aux sends on the desk introduces all sort of latency issues if you are using effects from within Pro Tools & this way solves that too. Obviously sending from the desk to normal outboard is totally fine and the Auxes on the console are still free to do this so you just end up with 16 Auxes in mixdown!

I have to say that for me there are no real downsides to having no recall. I’d much rather work this way than deal with a computer dating from the 70/80s that was a pain in the arse at the best of times.

I’ve tried nulling the faders on the whole console and automating from within Pro Tools on every track. The truth is your gain structure ends up so out of whack that you’re not getting the benefit of driving the channels and compressors properly. You’re missing out on a huge part of what makes these desks sound so great. The method above gives me a dynamic range of just under 90db when recording my stereo mix back into Pro Tools with all channels in the desk open and master fader set to zero. This is without the Quad Comp engaged but still is ridiculously quiet.”
« Last Edit: May 20, 2017, 04:55:40 PM by Jimbob »

axegreg

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 9
  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Working without Recall computer
« Reply #2 on: May 21, 2017, 02:41:48 AM »
Thanks Jimbob! Will definitely try out the things you've suggested.

seedubs

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 67
  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Working without Recall computer
« Reply #3 on: May 21, 2017, 07:41:45 PM »
"Using the Aux sends on the desk introduces all sort of latency issues if you are using effects from within Pro Tools & this way solves that too. Obviously sending from the desk to normal outboard is totally fine and the Auxes on the console are still free to do this so you just end up with 16 Auxes in mixdown!"

How is the latency different from using the aux sends? It seems like the same round trip latency would be in the directs as well as the aux sends. just wondering.

axegreg

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 9
  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Working without Recall computer
« Reply #4 on: May 27, 2017, 03:09:57 AM »
Tried out taking pics of the VCA levels and channel settings. Didn't quite work out for me, no mater how accurately I tried taking the pics with my Canon 10mgpix camera, I still was as much as 0.7db off on the VCA recalls, which when cumulative is a bit more than I'm willing to let go of. The channel knobs also came out a bit angled on the outside strips, so it made it harder for accurate settings recall. I know I'm being very picky, but I guess I'm sensitive to changes in the mix, having switched to ITB for the last 7 years. I'll keep searching and trying things, and see how close I can get. Any opinions or suggestions will be appreciated.

Clip6

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 311
  • Karma: +8/-1
Re: Working without Recall computer
« Reply #5 on: May 27, 2017, 04:29:21 AM »
THD LABS SSL computer is working great for some guys.

$5k solves your problems.

axegreg

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 9
  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Working without Recall computer
« Reply #6 on: May 27, 2017, 07:47:06 PM »
Yes, Clip6. I've seen it. Definitely looks like a good option down the road.

Robbie Ost

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 13
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • Vienna
    • go!EASTstudios
Re: Working without Recall computer
« Reply #7 on: June 19, 2017, 02:07:23 PM »
I do record all the channels back into the PC via the direct outs together with a reference mix from the master bus i used.
So all the levels and the sound is captured and you can open the mono files in all the DAWS available.
All you need to do then is set the panning and the panning law.
I use the Digicheck Global Recording feature for this, but you can use just the session in you DAW and record the tracks back into it.

Its quite astonishing how similar the DAW mix then sounds to the original mix.
Granted you can't do everything with it, especially when you have a lot of FX shared, but you are pretty close to a recall.
And of course you need a lot of AD converters for this, but they are quite affordable these days. ;)

Also you can bring back these tracks to the ssl at some point, switch it to replay and just zero the faders, set the panning and you will be back in buisness for the most parts.
hth

axegreg

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 9
  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Working without Recall computer
« Reply #8 on: June 20, 2017, 08:57:44 PM »
Thanks Robbie. Yes, that's a good way to do it. How are you dealing with recreating the "mix bus" feel ITB, being arguably the greatest SSL benefit?

seedubs

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 67
  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Working without Recall computer
« Reply #9 on: June 23, 2017, 09:05:24 PM »
SSL mix buss handles bass beautifully .

Robbie Ost

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 13
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • Vienna
    • go!EASTstudios
Re: Working without Recall computer
« Reply #10 on: July 03, 2017, 04:02:40 PM »
Thanks Robbie. Yes, that's a good way to do it. How are you dealing with recreating the "mix bus" feel ITB, being arguably the greatest SSL benefit?

Actually i don't.
When i do a "recall" this way I have it on my SSL anyway. And if it's ITB then it's mostly for rendering out samples or stems for remixing projects or such.
But it's a good way to keep a soundlocked project for the future, like the old 2" tapes in the storage. ;)
 

axegreg

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 9
  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Working without Recall computer
« Reply #11 on: July 04, 2017, 09:26:44 PM »
Thanks for clarifying Robbie.